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di652
Forum Enthusiast
Joined: 24 Feb 2005
Posts: 1180
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 Posted: Thu May 19, 2016 3:10 pm
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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| Mark P wrote: |
What in particular frustrates you? With due respect, you are asking questions in Webi about some of the simpler aspects of the tool  |
Most part is the stability. I have used DESKI and the earlier version of WEBI. DESKI was and is still rock solid with everything it can do.
Webi's earlier version were limited BUT the stability was FAR better than it is in this latest 4.x version.
I hang countless number of times, I cannot move as fast as I did within earlier version; ... but cannot think if anything else at the moment as I am trying get just simple report dumps. The IDT..... too many things to go on about how miserable they failed providing something we thought to be pretty slick. More of a pain to work in than anything else. So far any universe(multi or otherwise) I need I simply have multiple universes in UDT; works much much better and cleaner. IDT is hanging and moving slowly miserably with any type of thing you need to do; the more you add to it the worse off you are  |
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Mark P
Forum Devotee
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
Posts: 11526
Location: Manchester, UK
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Posted: Fri May 20, 2016 2:59 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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I find 4.1 Rich Client to be stable but agree that Webi itself can be flaky at times.
I've not used IDT in anger yet so cannot comment on how it should perform. I've always been concerned about the overall federation abilities of this and indeed any tool. I've worked with another data federation tool and it's a lazy way of trying to build a reporting database.
If SAP's vision is to have SAP BO as a BW/HANA tool only in the future, then split EDGE off to a separate unit and let it develop separately, as it probably needs to. At the moment it's failing to be all things to everyone.
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Current version I'm using: 4.1 SP3 over Oracle. Well versed in SQL Server too, including SSIS
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Prior versions used: BO3,4,5,6.5,XIr2,XI3, 4.1 - yes, I have been using BO since 1996!
Last edited by Mark P on Mon May 23, 2016 4:22 am, edited 1 time in total |
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MichaelWelter
Forum Advocate
Joined: 08 Aug 2002
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Posts: 15035
Location: Rancho Cucamonga, CA, USA, Earth, Milky Way
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Posted: Fri May 20, 2016 8:03 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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| Mark P wrote: | | I've not used IDT in anger yet so cannot comment on how it should perform. I've always been concerned about the overall federation abilities of this and indeed any tool. I've worked with another data federation tool and it's a lazy way of trying to build a reporting database. |
It's not a horrible tool. I like some of the features. However, given the choice, I still prefer to work in UDT. It's much more stable, and handles contexts much, much better than IDT.
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BIGuru
Forum Member
Joined: 09 Dec 2008
Posts: 28
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Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 10:46 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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I really do hate the idea of taking jobs to replace BO with (BLACH)MSTR or COGNOS.
Maybe I should have foreseen what SAP will do to demolish BO.... this IDT is just sickening to use
IDK, but I really miss the best company and tool(Business Objects) I recommended to just about 50 sites... right now I am just  about it not knowing the direction would go south instead of forward....... very  |
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ystu15
Forum Member
Joined: 10 Feb 2011
Posts: 24
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Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2016 10:02 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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It sounds like Business Objects was at the top of the list in the OLAP area.
I wish I got into it back then... now I am uncomfortable as this tool as gone from 'okay' in 2011 to ridiculous and cumbersome(very slow, memory hog, hanging,,,) now.
It more closely resembles how Crystal report builds and that ONLY technical personnel can use it.... not what this company was looking for and so went back to using lots and lots of EXCEL reports using Macros.
Again, I read and heard so much of the earlier versions... wish I had the opportunity.
Anyway, looking for macros on this site to help with XLS; hope I find something 
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Mark P
Forum Devotee
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
Posts: 11526
Location: Manchester, UK
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Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2016 5:13 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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| ystu15 wrote: | It sounds like Business Objects was at the top of the list in the OLAP area.
I wish I got into it back then... now I am uncomfortable as this tool as gone from 'okay' in 2011 to ridiculous and cumbersome(very slow, memory hog, hanging,,,) now.
It more closely resembles how Crystal report builds and that ONLY technical personnel can use it.... not what this company was looking for and so went back to using lots and lots of EXCEL reports using Macros.
Again, I read and heard so much of the earlier versions... wish I had the opportunity.
Anyway, looking for macros on this site to help with XLS; hope I find something
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This isn't an XLS macro site - try MSDN.
Cognos, imho, was always better at OLAP reporting than BO, given my experience of using both. Cognos had its own dedicated OLAP tools/engine for cube building. BO excelled/excels at reporting and adhoc analysis; OLAP analysis within Cognos, SSAS, etc. is great but you are confined to the items within the cube if you want to do anything quickly.
Webi itself IS a non-technical tool by and large; that is, 80% of it doesn't require any real technical knowledge beyond a basic course as with Excel. The devil is in the complexity of the remaining 20% (which probably account for 50% of development time).
The key to success, assuming that the underlying data platform is sound, is the semantic layer; in our case, the universe. If this is built well and adds value to the underlying data model rather than simply replicating it, then the reporting is a lot simpler.
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Current version I'm using: 4.1 SP3 over Oracle. Well versed in SQL Server too, including SSIS
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Prior versions used: BO3,4,5,6.5,XIr2,XI3, 4.1 - yes, I have been using BO since 1996! |
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Joealyche
Principal Member
Joined: 29 Feb 2012
Posts: 431
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Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 5:04 pm
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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I am starting to see that more companies are going away from SAP and jumping on to tools like LOOKER
Seems that no one is getting support or fond of the SAP Help Desk arena; that is the big thing I am seeing. Wonder if anyone is seeing the same!?
Shame because SAPBO is still great in my book but with the lack of support and the expense tools like LOOKER is making its way up. But from what I see LOOKER does not offer anything that BO doesn't. So I am thinking its the expense and the support. High and support not there
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Wolfgang Bidner
Forum Associate
Joined: 30 Aug 2002
Posts: 573
Location: Vienna/Austria
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:34 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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I see it also coming - leting SAC Cloud Promotion go nuts -the traditional good old Webi will stay behind - from Marketing view - and all others will try to get a hold on BI market share - because of lack of some Basic Marketing skills and keeping the development in mind. But I also see very engaged WEBI-responsible persons doing there Job despite SAP Cloud FIRST trump-ets... Mr. Botticchio ... and others..
wobi
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Mark P
Forum Devotee
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
Posts: 11526
Location: Manchester, UK
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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2018 7:16 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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| Joealyche wrote: | I am starting to see that more companies are going away from SAP and jumping on to tools like LOOKER
Seems that no one is getting support or fond of the SAP Help Desk arena; that is the big thing I am seeing. Wonder if anyone is seeing the same!?
Shame because SAPBO is still great in my book but with the lack of support and the expense tools like LOOKER is making its way up. But from what I see LOOKER does not offer anything that BO doesn't. So I am thinking its the expense and the support. High and support not there
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Add to that the learning curve for both developers and general users if you've got BO thoroughly embedded in your business. You don't see many companies move between Cognos and BO because of the investment in changing between them and their inherent similarity. It's usually a decision made when the company moves from Access and Excel on to a proper reporting platform and then stuck with regardless.
_________________
Current version I'm using: 4.1 SP3 over Oracle. Well versed in SQL Server too, including SSIS
______________________________________
Prior versions used: BO3,4,5,6.5,XIr2,XI3, 4.1 - yes, I have been using BO since 1996! |
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ABILtd
Forum Enthusiast
Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Posts: 1915
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Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:08 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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| Joealyche wrote: | I am starting to see that more companies are going away from SAP and jumping on to tools like LOOKER
Seems that no one is getting support or fond of the SAP Help Desk arena; that is the big thing I am seeing. Wonder if anyone is seeing the same!?
Shame because SAPBO is still great in my book but with the lack of support and the expense tools like LOOKER is making its way up. But from what I see LOOKER does not offer anything that BO doesn't. So I am thinking its the expense and the support. High and support not there
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LOOKER and SAP BI are very very different use cases. One`s Cloud for a start, so if you have a customer comparing side by side, I would hazard a guess that they don`t fully know what they`re doing. Looker doesn`t do enterprise reporting for a start and building a metalayer in it requires coding LookML, SAP BI has the amazing Universe designer or IDT.
There are a lot of Cloud BI solutions out there now but not one does enterprise reporting, which, going on all the customers I speak to, is still very important.
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MichaelWelter
Forum Advocate
Joined: 08 Aug 2002
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Posts: 15035
Location: Rancho Cucamonga, CA, USA, Earth, Milky Way
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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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IMHO, SAP Really shot themselves in the foot recently with their announcement that Lumira is no longer on the product roadmap. Just a year ago, they were telling everyone to invest in Lumira, and many companies did, only to be abandoned by SAP this year. It's frustrating. SAP can't seem to figure out what they want to be when they grow up.
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di652
Forum Enthusiast
Joined: 24 Feb 2005
Posts: 1180
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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:17 pm
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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SAP ruined BOBJ first off by putting more emphasis on Crystal... What were they thinking, they would have been great if they just pushed Crystal out of the picture and kept Deski(for one thing) as the user app of choice. I mean, users are not and probably never going to get away from Excel. Deski made it all work out... With some tweaking no other product would have bested it.
Business Objects should have just stayed Business Objects. I think they would have still been the TOP GUN but.... SAP has no clue on what to do with it. |
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ABILtd
Forum Enthusiast
Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Posts: 1915
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Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2018 5:06 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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| di652 wrote: | SAP ruined BOBJ first off by putting more emphasis on Crystal... What were they thinking, they would have been great if they just pushed Crystal out of the picture and kept Deski(for one thing) as the user app of choice. I mean, users are not and probably never going to get away from Excel. Deski made it all work out... With some tweaking no other product would have bested it.
Business Objects should have just stayed Business Objects. I think they would have still been the TOP GUN but.... SAP has no clue on what to do with it. |
If you pushed Crystal out of the picture in terms of the BI platform, there would be no platform.....
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BI and Analytics Presales Consultant
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BOXI R1, R2, R3, R3.1, R4.1, R4.2, CE 8, 8.5, 9, 10, SAP Analytics Cloud, Crystal Reports, Lumira, PowerBI, Tableau, JasperServer, iReport, LogiAnalytics, BIRST, Qlikview, Xcelcius, Netezza, T-SQL, PLSQL, DTS, SSIS, BODI, BODS, Kimble etc....
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Mark P
Forum Devotee
Joined: 03 Feb 2003
Posts: 11526
Location: Manchester, UK
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Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2018 5:57 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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| ABILtd wrote: | | di652 wrote: | SAP ruined BOBJ first off by putting more emphasis on Crystal... What were they thinking, they would have been great if they just pushed Crystal out of the picture and kept Deski(for one thing) as the user app of choice. I mean, users are not and probably never going to get away from Excel. Deski made it all work out... With some tweaking no other product would have bested it.
Business Objects should have just stayed Business Objects. I think they would have still been the TOP GUN but.... SAP has no clue on what to do with it. |
If you pushed Crystal out of the picture in terms of the BI platform, there would be no platform..... |
Ignoring the architecture, when talking about the actual, he's spot on though.
_________________
Current version I'm using: 4.1 SP3 over Oracle. Well versed in SQL Server too, including SSIS
______________________________________
Prior versions used: BO3,4,5,6.5,XIr2,XI3, 4.1 - yes, I have been using BO since 1996! |
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ABILtd
Forum Enthusiast
Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Posts: 1915
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Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2018 6:15 am
Post subject: Re: Good-Bye DESKI and Good-Bye SAP BO |
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Crystal and Deski\Webi are 2 completely different use cases with some crossover though. Same as the use cases for Lumira (RIP) and Webi are different with some crossover.
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BI and Analytics Presales Consultant
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BOXI R1, R2, R3, R3.1, R4.1, R4.2, CE 8, 8.5, 9, 10, SAP Analytics Cloud, Crystal Reports, Lumira, PowerBI, Tableau, JasperServer, iReport, LogiAnalytics, BIRST, Qlikview, Xcelcius, Netezza, T-SQL, PLSQL, DTS, SSIS, BODI, BODS, Kimble etc....
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